Well, I opened my email tonight to find these two emails. How would you respond?
This is the first:
hello, well i got the shoes today and im disapointed... you said they were brand new but they arent you can tell in the back part of the shoe that they were wore because is kind of smashed like when you try to put shoes on babies... i compared them with some other timberlads i bought just in a bigger size and this look used... i dont think you should be advertising used stuff like new... im not happy

This came second, within an hour of the first. I didnt even have time to repond to the first one yet.:
after looking at your feedback i saw a lot of people that u sold stuff that wasnt new... i went and review the descriptions on the item that u sold me and it says new.. never worn...i looked at the pix butyou cant really tell from those pix. and like i said i compared them with the same type of she but in a bigger size and they look reallllyyy used the back part of it i still didnt leave you feedback because i want to fix this i dont like leaving negatinve feedback just like that.
If you are interested, here is a link to the auction she is referring to:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4865...name=ADME:B:AAQ:US:1
While she is dogging my feedback, I would also like to add I currently have a score of 1756 + feedback and a 99.8% average. She does have 100% but with only 10 feedback. How would you respond to this person?
Original Post
wow, that stinks. I think your right she didn't know what size to buy or is just trying to get something for nothing.

I'm sad to say I see a neg coming no matter what you do. There is a slight chance she has you mixed up with the other seller she bought shoes from if they are the same.

If it was me (being the sucker I am) I would tell her I'd issue her a refund minus shipping upon reciept of the shoes if they are returned in the same condition. Sadly if she goes to paypal there is a chance she'll probably get all of her money back anyway at least this way you save on the shipping.

Let us know how it goes.
I sent her an answer saying I would give her a refund of the bid amount if she returned the shoes to me in the same condition they were shipped to her in. I told her I was sorry that she was unhappy with them, but that they WERE new as advertised. I also told her I hoped that by the time she has as many feedback as I have that she is able to maintain her 100% since it is nearly impossible to please everyone. This was the response I got this time:

quote:
quote:
Ok the quotes didnt work for me, I will just post it:
Oh I know you had some negative but a lot neutral and it said it was because
of stuff that it was advertised as new but it wasn't.... anyhow... the tag
on the tongue of the shoe is sooo faded is not even funny I just think is
sooo silly that you would advertise it as new I mean if its not then its
not.... I like the shoes I just thought it was wrong that u said they were
new. And so are you gonna pay for return shipping? If you are I will send
them right back my baby didn't try them on yet... what about the shipping
cost??? You should of specify all this and I wouldn't mind keeping the shoes
I paid 21.65 total for something that was false advertising... im not trying
to sound like a total a hole but I just think is wrong to false
advertise.... if u are paying for the shipping and I get back my money I
will return them


I really hate being called a liar. Since 95% of my things are used, why would I bother saying this was new if it wasnt?
Looks to me like she got the other pair cheaper and figures the baby can grow into the size 2. Just the whole tone of her email makes me agree with Lisa that she's no newbie. She really wanted those boots and probably didn't think she'd win both auctions so she's unfairly complaining and hinting about the neg she's going to give you to scare you into taking them back AND paying return shipping.

I would tell her a deal's a deal, you KNOW they were brand new and that she bought an identical pair at the same time. If she thinks she needs to leave you a negative because you won't pay return shipping, then so be it. One negative lost in the sea of all your positives won't look nearly as bad as her one negative out of 11. lol Blackmail her back. Stand your ground and be firm. Make sure she knows that you have investigated and seen that she won an identical pair for less money and ask her if that's the real reason for her complaint.

Just my two cents. People like that irk me.

Good luck!
Jeri
Also, what does this mean?

quote:
you can tell in the back part of the shoe that they were wore because is kind of smashed like when you try to put shoes on babies


I couldn't be sure she's lying about all of it but it seems to me that when they come back in a new e-mail with a new reason (the tongue is faded) that's usually a good indicator. I'd bet that if you kept pussyfooting around that the next e-mail would have another new reason they're "obviously" worn.
What you all seem to be forgetting is that it's against eBays rules & regs to threaten/extort negative feedback...
I.E., it's a reportable offense.
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/feedback-extortion.html

I'd report her so fast her head would be spinning. She might not be aware of the ruling and you can notify her that it is most definitely a reportable offense and she will be reported if she doesn't keep her communication in a business like manner. (still report her just let her think your not reporting her just warning her)

Daayyyummm newbies. Gotta wonder if she's done this before under another ID.

Do zactly what Jeri/Signsintime states about letting her know you took the time to see that she won an identical pair. Once "outed" she may back off thinking she has the upper hand.

Good Luck!
Donna
Well, I offerred her a refund even though my listings say all sales are final. She is still angry because I won't pay her shipping to return them. She is now telling me what I should and shouldnt do. I replied this time with an equally nasty email. Cussing at me three times in a row is just too much! I fully expect a negative now! Oh well!
Oh, and in my latest email, I did ask her if she was size shopping, since she bought almost identical shoes in two difference sizes just days from each other. I know that I make typos, but I would really like to tell her to learn how to read and write before trying to master online shopping!
She's Cursing? Oh that frosts me.

I would definitely take a few hours off and not look at her emails.

When she can behave in a business manner then I would respond. You could always notify her that eBay does not tolerate that sort of language (even though they don't give a flying flip, they'll just tell you to report to the authorities if you feel threatened)

Ya know, this is gonna seem awful, but...the only cursing emails I receive are from persons under the age of 30. I had one about 2 weeks ago and she had some pretty foul language sprinkled in my customers emails to me.

I stopped her short and told her when she could respond to me in a business-like professional manner then I would handle her request, but until then, I wouldn't be spoken to in that manner.

She then called me an old beeyatch (but she spelled the other way) and told me I needed to get with the times, that everyone talks that way now.

I waited 12 hours and responded in kind with that's right..I am what you say I am. I'm what you probably consider old. But I am not a female dog. Your emails have been forwarded to eBay's Safe Harbor so notes may be made in regards to our transaction. (like Safe harbor would care) I told her our communication was over until she could handle herself in a proper business-like manner.

Within 2 hours I received an apology email from her and we moved forward to complete our transaction.

Worthless little piece of eBay buyer crappola is what I wanted to say..but didn't. I'm not a prude by any means and have been known to pepper my sentences from time to time. But did she think that cursing, threatening and more towards me would intimidate me? Well, it didn't.

Walk away...Take a breather.

Forward everything you've got. If you need more reasons, I'll see if I have the links.

Pull her contact information..that would be good, too. eBay is going to advise you to do that. Plus, those that are angry in email? When you call them, they will normally calm right down. I had one customer last year that was hateful as all get out. I pulled her contact information. Called her and her phone number was disconnected. I reported her for inaccurate information on file. http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/identity-false.html

I emailed her and notified her that I'd tried to call but the number was no longer working. She cursed me. I reported her. EBAY cancelled her account within 12 hours. YEAH!!!!

Good Luck!
Donna
quote:
This came second, within an hour of the first. I didnt even have time to repond to the first one yet.:
after looking at your feedback i saw a lot of people that u sold stuff that wasnt new... i went and review the descriptions on the item that u sold me and it says new.. never worn...i looked at the pix butyou cant really tell from those pix. and like i said i compared them with the same type of she but in a bigger size and they look reallllyyy used the back part of it i still didnt leave you feedback because i want to fix this i dont like leaving negatinve feedback just like that.
If you are interested, here is a link to the auction she is referring to:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4865...name=ADME:B:AAQ:US:1
While she is dogging my feedback, I would also like to add I currently have a score of 1756 + feedback and a 99.8% average. She does have 100% but with only 10 feedback. How would you respond to this person?




"i still didnt leave you feedback because i want to fix this i dont like leaving negatinve feedback just like that."


The bottom line is, the above statement is feedback extortion and IS against eBay rules. Period. End of discussion.

My initial response would have been. (assuming the shoes are 'new'),

(Buyers Name)

The shoes purchased are new. I do not and would never claim an item is new, unless it is indeed a new item. My long and positive feedback record clearly reflects many, many happy customers. I'm sorry, you're unhappy with the shoes. However, it is not because they aren't new shoes. It is the buyers' responsibility to know what size they require for an item. I see you've recently purchased two different shoe sizes. Perhaps, you've decided the larger size better suits your needs. Or prefer the larger shoes. Either way, it is not my responsibilty to provide you a return for buyers remorse. As all of my listings clearly state, I do not offer returns.

Your second email is a direct violation of eBay policy. No buyer can resort to feedback extortion as a means of obtaining a refund or anything for that matter. You cannot threaten negative feedback to obtain a refund. I see you have a feedback rating of 10. So, I'm going to give you the benefit of doubt that you're 'unaware' of this eBay feedback policy.

I have recorded and I am prepared to forward all correspondence between us regarding this transaction to eBay for review. Should you choose to leave me a negative feedback rating because I would not give into your feedback extortion, I will without a doubt forward all correspondence to eBay. In accordance with eBay policy, your bogus negative feedback will be removed.

I went above board and offered you a refund minus shipping having sold you a beautiful new pair of shoes and 'still' this isn't good enough? The shoes are new. I haven't done a single thing that warrants negative feedback. I consider this transaction closed.

If you have any further questions don't hesitate to contact me.

Kind regards,

**************
OK, now I get this:
see judging from your responses you are rude... i have the shoes because the ones i have are huge for my baby... and she is a only 3 weeks old. yeah all sales are final but u should at least be honest... i had a similar problem before but the seller actually told me the truth and kept the item i just think you are so rude. even from the feedback that was left for you and i was reading the responses you left they are pretty bad... i know what im gonna do. and u shouldnt be assuming that i want a refound because is the wrong size i got the same shoes size 5 now why would i go from a 5 to a 1 that is silly....

Now I am rude because I told her that I would no longer discuss this issue since she was resorting to feedback extortion.
quote:
Originally posted by moodymama1024:
OK, now I get this:
see judging from your responses you are rude... i have the shoes because the ones i have are huge for my baby... and she is a only 3 weeks old. yeah all sales are final but u should at least be honest... i had a similar problem before but the seller actually told me the truth and kept the item i just think you are so rude. even from the feedback that was left for you and i was reading the responses you left they are pretty bad... i know what im gonna do. and u shouldnt be assuming that i want a refound because is the wrong size i got the same shoes size 5 now why would i go from a 5 to a 1 that is silly....

Now I am rude because I told her that I would no longer discuss this issue since she was resorting to feedback extortion.


Translation: You're rude because you won't give in to my demands.

Keep all of the correspondence for at least 90 days in an email folder. Just move on. Let it go.
What's funny about this entire thread is:

#1, this entire hassle is about $15 ($20 total). Refund the money and move on. Tell her to keep, or eat, or do anything she wants with the shoes. These people are not worth your time, especially for $15.

#2, you seem to think eBay gives a damn about you, the seller. You seem to think that reporting a user to ebay will do something. Sorry to be so cyincal, but ha, ha.

#3, you seem to think eBay will support you in "following the rules". The "rules" only work for eBay, not for you. See #2.

#4, I saw no "feedback extortion". She wants to work something out before leaving a negative or a positive. If you you think YOU are in the right, and don't care about the potential negative, then tell her "all sales final" and move on. You can't please everyone. If you think reporting this user to eBay for "feedback extortion" will do anything, see #2.

Sorry to be so overly negative. You have to try to work your problems out without eBay. I've had over 8 years of eBay and their BS. If it wasn't for the fact I still make some pocket money, I'd have nothing to do with this two faced greedy monster.
Jeff, I do agree with #2. I have seen too many times that ebay doesn't give a damn about the seller. If there were any other venues where i could make as much as I do on ebay, I would give it up in a heartbeat. But the fact is, while I also sell on other sites, they do not have the volume of buyers that ebay does. It isnt even about the $15 (which actually would be around $25 because she wants shipping both ways), it is about the act that I am disgusted with this buyer and needing to vent as well as ask advice.
quote:
Originally posted by JeffS:
What's funny about this entire thread is:

#1, this entire hassle is about $15 ($20 total). Refund the money and move on. Tell her to keep, or eat, or do anything she wants with the shoes. These people are not worth your time, especially for $15.

#2, you seem to think eBay gives a damn about you, the seller. You seem to think that reporting a user to ebay will do something. Sorry to be so cyincal, but ha, ha.

#3, you seem to think eBay will support you in "following the rules". The "rules" only work for eBay, not for you. See #2.

#4, I saw no "feedback extortion". She wants to work something out before leaving a negative or a positive. If you you think YOU are in the right, and don't care about the potential negative, then tell her "all sales final" and move on. You can't please everyone. If you think reporting this user to eBay for "feedback extortion" will do anything, see #2.

Sorry to be so overly negative. You have to try to work your problems out without eBay. I've had over 8 years of eBay and their BS. If it wasn't for the fact I still make some pocket money, I'd have nothing to do with this two faced greedy monster.


I disagree.

I would 'eat' a negative before I would refund .01 to a buyer who is trying to extort, control or get something for nothing. If it were $100, $1,000 or $10,000 would it then be a different matter? The money, isn't the point. Sellers shouldn't be held hostage to buyers who feel they have the right to totally disregard any and all of a sellers terms.

Even if a complete refund is given, guess what? The buyer can and many times will 'still' post a negative feedback rating. If by chance, they post a positive FB rating (having placed the fear of a negative into said seller and received whatever demands they made) now, this bogus buyer is passed onto the next seller without recourse.

This goes beyond money. Although, $15 isn't much, $15 times every buyer who pulls this type of crap adds up over time. It adds up in dollars and the feeling you are a prisoner to this type of buyer. Some people would rather grant such unfair demnads and move on. Hey, whatever works, I guess.

Not me. I will not be held prisoner to these type of buyers. If this buyer presisted on harrassing me, I would tell them to do whatever they feel they must do, and I would do the same. Then they would be blocked as a buyer and blocked from email correspondence.

If I had 1,700 positive feedback rating to a buyer with a mere 10...enough said. I'd eat the neg, respond to bogus neg and move on.

I do agree that getting caught up in some kind of transaction drama is a huge waste of time. It serves nothing and is unprofessional. A single email that's to the point, says all that needs to be said is all that's required.

I've had buyers try to muscle me with negative feedback. I've told them flat out, I will not be held hostage to feedback extortion and if they wanted to neg me to go right ahead.

Funny how not one of them has!

I have received 3 negs.

1) from a buyer who kept changing, delaying and not paying her bill. Who finally negged me because I couldn't take her credit card by telephone.

2) from an international buyer who won an item (if I had checked her FB prior to her winning, her bid would have been cancelled) she scammed me. I allowed her to pay via PayPal and 6 weeks later she claimed non-receipt. She then went on to do this to many, many sellers.

3) from a buyer who raved how much they LOVED their pants but how they were too small. They were suppose to return them for a merchandise credit...only to wait exactly 90 days and neg me.

I have yet, to receive a deserved negative feedback rating. Guess what? I have deserved to receive a couple of negs. The negs I've recived were underserved. Most negs you get will be undeserved. It's the nature of the poorly created eBay feedback system. Don't waste your time arguing with buyers. Stand your ground and move on.

On last thing, receiving a neg isn't the end of the world.

Let it go.
Probably should not say this because I will get some grief but ask if he/she needs a thesaurus or a dictionary.Sorry I know I should not say that but it just p***** me off when you get unwarranted comments by people who can not use or speak the queens english Frog.
ps i think there is one * too many Smile
ohh hang on no there is not wooohooo Razz
I hope my spell check is set to UK Confused
Remember A Negative is not the end of the world !!!!
jeffs post is spot on !!!!!
Everyone is free to disagree with me. It's my opinion. It's my opinion of eBay, which I think is the most disgusting company on earth next to oil companies. It's opinion of this particular buyer who is not worth your time. Period.

A good example of this is it went from "I am not satisfied, what can we do about this?" to "You are a rude person". Personally I have no time for BS like that. eBay will not help or stand behind you. You are nothing to eBay.

If you feel you want to get into a pissing contest with people (buyers), you are absolutely free to do so. That's your right, I won't argue with you. That wasn't my point.

To me, these types of buyers are 'ants'. They are to be ignored. They can not be satisfied. You should get away from them as quickly as possible and get back to business. Why do you think stores try to get rid of complainers as quickly as possible? So they don't make a scene, attract attention, and hurt business. Complainers exist. You found one. Fortunately I have have had very very few of them to deal with. But we all get them every now and then.
quote:
Originally posted by moodymama1024:
... i went and review the descriptions on the item that u sold me and it says new.. never worn...i looked at the pix butyou cant really tell from those pix. .....and they look reallllyyy used the back part of it....

If you are interested, here is a link to the auction she is referring to:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4865...name=ADME:B:AAQ:US:1


I disagree. The pictures DO show clearly the condition of the shoes, and there is no damage apparent at all.

That's my 2 cents on this issue. I hope that it gets resolved, or it dies a quick death so that you can get on with business!
Jeff,
You are right about the pissing contest. She has sent me 4 more emails with new excuses about why the shoes are not new. I told her in my last email that I would no longer respond to further emails from her. I have not responded to the last 4. I refuse to continue having a battle of wits with an unarmed person. To be honest, I kind of feel sorry for her. My 10 year old can complete sentences better than this person.
quote:
Originally posted by moodymama1024:
Jeff,
You are right about the pissing contest. I refuse to continue having a battle of wits with an unarmed person.

Suthrnjewl<----smiling

There's ALOT of great advice in this thread. A nice collection of everyone's thoughts that work together real well.

Simco's statement regarding the thesarus tickled my funny bone, too! <smile>

You're doing the right thing by moving along.

My best,
Donna
Two things:

quote:
I replied this time with an equally nasty email.


This will destroy any credibility or professionalism you displayed up to that point. Believe me, I know it takes a ton of self-restraint, I'm just saying.

quote:
I saw no "feedback extortion".


Holding negative feedback over the seller's head is feedback extortion. Bringing up the possibility of it happening is a threat.

And it's a good example of why the feedback system doesn't work. Too many people are just no good.

moodymama, however this works out I do hope you've added this person to your blocked bidders list. Otherwise, she'll probably be back again for the same sort of deal.
It sounds like she got the idea somewhere that she could complain about the product and get a partial refund.

Her shoe complaints are ridiculous. I've sold shoes and fitted many babies with their first pair. I know we're talking crib shoes and not walking shoes, but still...

1) You don't mush down the back of baby shoes unless you have absolutely NO idea what you're doing. The child's foot would never be in them properly, the kiddo would not appreciate having their shoes pushed on like that. These shoes have fasteners to open and close them. The only way I can see them getting smushed in back is if Mom was trying to get a shoe that was WAY too small on the child.

Older kids mash the backs of shoes shoving them on and off without untying. Not infants.

Sometimes with a dress shoe we'll work the back a little to make them more comfortable for the initial try-on. I doubt crib shoes would have a stiff back so this shouldn't apply here.

2) A crawling infant would un-new a pair of shoes like that very quickly. A pink nubuck would show dirt and wear if it was not new. The shoes look very nice and new.

3) The only thing I can potentially see for her to complain about is the bottom. I think it's just the lighting and/or the nap of the material, but they look like there might be a slight amount of wear there.

Light colors will pick up dirt even from a try-on. If these have been worn, I suspect they were worn for a photo then returned to a store or something like that. If they were in new condition, they were in new condition.
Thanks for your post starrynight. I have been wondering what "smushed back, like when you put them on a baby" meant ever since she wrote that. I guess all I had to think about was my 10 year old shoving her foot in without untying her shoes. The backs were definately not smushed!
Anyway, she left feedback. It is positive amazingly. I guess she did not want a red mark on her (even though I never said I would leave her a neg if she did) but this is what it says
"shoes are lovely but not new as listed... good communication fast shipping." I would really like to leave her one saying Customer paid quickly but is a PIA. lol

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